PostFrontal Forum
PostFrontal Forum
LK8000_Support_Forum | Profile | Register | Active Topics | Members | Search | FAQ
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

 All Forums
 LK8000 International Support
 Delta/Hang Gliders
 Starting the Delta HG version
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
Next Page
Author Previous Topic Topic Next Topic
Page: of 3

Coolwind
Moderator

Italy
8957 Posts

Posted - 14/11/2009 :  01:36:12  Show Profile  Visit Coolwind's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Officially starting on monday also the Delta HG version of the software. Active HG pilots are welcome here to discuss features. I need a couple of reference pilots for beta tester selection. Skype phone calls are mandatory, official language is english (fluent).
Please spread the voice..

nosbig
Pulcino

USA
25 Posts

Posted - 16/11/2009 :  14:17:33  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thank you Paolo for adding the Delta section.
There are a couple of places (online) where I can spread the news about LK8000 very quickly. I am guessing that you will have many delta pilots signing into the forum. Hopefully the forum can handle the population increase (!).

I know some competition pilots who live in warm climates and they might be able to give you data/test feedback often during the next few months. (winter is almost here in NW Michigan so flying days for me will be minimal very soon)

Question --- In spreading the news about LK8000, is the link below the best one for pilots interested in this software?
http://www.bware.it/xcsoar/

---> JG


Go to Top of Page

Coolwind
Moderator

Italy
8957 Posts

Posted - 16/11/2009 :  14:32:01  Show Profile  Visit Coolwind's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Currently I have no time to dedicate to that page, and I am not good with web at all.
But yes, so far that's the official page, that points here.
We are approaching now the documentation phase, since all features for PG and HG need some explanation otherwise they are hidden under the GUI!
Go to Top of Page

nosbig
Pulcino

USA
25 Posts

Posted - 17/11/2009 :  16:53:03  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
While waiting for responses from individual delta glider manufacturers I am posting a link found on the Wills Wing website that shows polars
for some of their models. Please note that their newest high performance model (T2C) is not shown. The Falcon is typical of an entry level model, the next three would be considered intermediate kingpost models, the U2 is an advanced kingpost glider and the Talon is the high performing 'topless' model. Here is the link:
http://www.willswing.com/Articles/Article.asp?reqArticleName=PolarData#
Hopefully this is a starting point for average delta glider performance polars.
---> JG
Go to Top of Page

parapenT1sta
Pterodattilo

Portugal
1864 Posts

Posted - 17/11/2009 :  17:44:32  Show Profile  Visit parapenT1sta's Homepage  Click to see parapenT1sta's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote
I think after all Paolo's dedication on the paraglider mode, Delta mode will be easier ;)

Nosbig, what type of waypoint files do you use normally? Compe, Ozi Explorer, Garmin?

Edited by - parapenT1sta on 17/11/2009 17:45:17
Go to Top of Page

BigBird
Falchetto

Germany
133 Posts

Posted - 17/11/2009 :  18:15:03  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi nosbig,

if you have access to several delta polars you can create the polar files for LK by yourself.
LK can work with Winpilot polars, have a look at the attached link:
http://www.winpilot.com/polar.asp


Go to Top of Page

bo.
Pterodattilo

843 Posts

Posted - 17/11/2009 :  20:12:05  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
From the Wills Wing website:

Model V1 V2
Falcon 215@19 530@34

I see they present polar data with only two airspeed/sink values per glider. Maybe this makes sense for the Brauniger instruments that the data should be used with, but we (and LK, I guess) need three values to fit the second order polynominal that represents the polar.. Or is there something I am missing?

Go to Top of Page

BigBird
Falchetto

Germany
133 Posts

Posted - 17/11/2009 :  21:44:26  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
bo,
take the values out of the graphic,
for the falcon I would use
19 mph
27 ..
34 ..

if one pair is missing I do not know how LK will calculate the performance of the delta
Go to Top of Page

nosbig
Pulcino

USA
25 Posts

Posted - 18/11/2009 :  13:52:58  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
TiGuy82, I have been creating waypoint files the 'old-fashioned' way by using Google Earth for co-ordinates and a topo map for elevation and then manually editing a .dat file that I created. Is there a more modern method that is easier?

BigBird, I have written to all of the major delta glider manufacturers asking if they would share accurate polars of their gliders to be used with LK8000. I also sent them the link to http://www.bware.it/xcsoar/. My reason for direct contact was that they might be encouraged join the discussion and/or read what is happening here. I suggested that if liability was a concern then they could share the data not specifically for a named glider model but as per a general class of glider. Wills Wing is the first company to respond so far
and they directed me to their website link (listed above). I hope the other companies respond as well. ----> JG
Go to Top of Page

parapenT1sta
Pterodattilo

Portugal
1864 Posts

Posted - 18/11/2009 :  14:25:01  Show Profile  Visit parapenT1sta's Homepage  Click to see parapenT1sta's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by nosbig

TiGuy82, I have been creating waypoint files the 'old-fashioned' way by using Google Earth for co-ordinates and a topo map for elevation and then manually editing a .dat file that I created. Is there a more modern method that is easier?


I was asking because in Paragliding competition we use that type of files and I wanted to know if you used them too.

I would like that Paolo can suport them on LK8000.

I use www.gpsbabel.org to convert them.
Go to Top of Page

BigBird
Falchetto

Germany
133 Posts

Posted - 18/11/2009 :  15:26:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
nosbig
-waypoints
and very accurate data base you find at:
http://www.segelflug.de/vereine/welt2000/
57000 Waypoints
25000 landings incl. 22000 Airports world wide

http://www.segelflug.de/vereine/welt2000/download/Welt200E_09-06-19.exe
the link to download the database and the software tool for selecting the waypoints/airports you like to have.

alternatively:
http://soaringweb.org/TP/
both databased are well used among glider pilots, probably also useful for you

all data you are getting LK compatible out of both sources. Choose Winpilot or Cambridge302


Go to Top of Page

nosbig
Pulcino

USA
25 Posts

Posted - 19/11/2009 :  02:34:23  Show Profile  Reply with Quote

Thank you BigBird ... I'll check each of the links you listed.

Paolo, I wrote to Davis Straub (editor of the Oz Report) to let him know about LK8000 and your request for delta glider polars. He suggested the polar data for hang gliders in SeeYou. (Does anyone here use SeeYou and is able to share the delta polars?)

Most of Davis Straub's flying is in competitions and he responded to Paolo's request for general delta task information with this:
1) Task specification: Start cylinder (exit and entry), size (kilometers), turn point cylinder radius (400 meters, most likely),
goal: cylinder or line (length and perpendicular to the course line).

2) Multiple start times, take the last one. Number of start times and interval length, and first start time.

3) Flytec 6030 specs would be good.

Hope this helps a little ---> JG
Go to Top of Page

parapenT1sta
Pterodattilo

Portugal
1864 Posts

Posted - 19/11/2009 :  11:40:48  Show Profile  Visit parapenT1sta's Homepage  Click to see parapenT1sta's MSN Messenger address  Reply with Quote
Nosbig,

As I can see your requests are the same of paragliders pilots, as I can see I made a post with the "best" configurations for paragliders, take a look: http://www.postfrontal.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2941
Go to Top of Page

JFS737
Pulcino

10 Posts

Posted - 21/11/2009 :  06:02:40  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi guys,
I'm new here. I fly HG's and was trying to use XCSoar with a PocketPC and a 5030. I have it working but need to add batteries to the PPC so they last longer than 2 hours.

I am a bit confused as to the LK8000... it's a new version of XCSoar I guess? It's only for PNA's now and PPC are no longer supported? I read over at the PG link and they are testing it, but I can't determine on what hardware. What are they using to test this thing? I see the HP Ipaq 310 can be had for about $140 used.

I have SEEYou and have access to the polar data. I'll post what they have in my next post. Thanks for any help.

John
Go to Top of Page

JFS737
Pulcino

10 Posts

Posted - 21/11/2009 :  06:14:26  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Name: ATOS
Min Load (kg/m2): 10
Stall (mph: 19
a 7.73
b -5.72
c 1.78
1 (mph/fpm): 60/681.9
2 (mph/fpm): 75/1208.17
3 (mph/fpm) 95/2185.71
Max L/D: 16.4
Wmin (fpm) 142.09

Name: ATOS VX
Min Load (kg/m2): 9.0
Stall (mph): 19
a 7.85
b -5.88
c 1.72
1 (mph, fpm) 60/661.72
2 (mph, fpm) 75/1192.76
3 (mph, fpm) 95/2180.96
Max L/D: 18.9
Wmin (fpm) 121.83


Name: WW Eagle
Min Load (kg/m2): 9.0
Stall (mph): 19
a 25.52
b -17.65
c 4.09
1 (mph, fpm) 60/2134.21
2 (mph, fpm) 75/3930.23
3 (mph, fpm) 95/7235.7
Max L/D: 10.0
Wmin (fpm) 204.38


Name: WW Falcon
Min Load (kg/m2): 9.0
Stall (mph): 19
a 16.25
b -7.31
c 1.79
1 (mph, fpm) 60/1945.44
2 (mph, fpm) 75/3275.76
3 (mph, fpm) 95/5629.46
Max L/D: 8.0
Wmin (fpm) 190.53


I have a few more if you want that came with it and I added one.

John
Go to Top of Page

JFS737
Pulcino

10 Posts

Posted - 21/11/2009 :  06:35:31  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
My thoughts on XCSoar / LK8000...

I like XCSoar quite a bit and it worked well with the 5030 but my PPC display was a bit dim, and the battery life was short. I fly with the 5030 so don't need many things in a second device, but here are a few big ones (from memory).

I fly lots of XC and some comps but big concerns and desires for me are in order of must haves....

1. Airspace and moving map depiction. NEED to get close but not in restricted airspace. MOVING MAP with AIRSPACE is Number ONE.
2. More custom NAV Boxes /INFO : Have lots of info on 5030 but displaying some on a PND would free up some 5030 slots. XCSoar covered it all well. (Arr Alt, Dist Rem, Dist around TP, Final Alt req, Sist to Home Wpt, L/D, Time, etc., etc.)
3. PORTRAIT MODE. I fly UP the page and landscape on a moving map is no good at all. It must be PORTRAIT mode to allow me to "see" further ahead and less to my left and right.
4. Routes and tasks with Start and Turn points as well as finish on the Moving Map.
5. MUST be able to quickly download saved .igc files or waypoints in a secure fashion so I can use it as my backup GPS in a Comp. Most guys fly with 5030 and a backup GPS. If I use this software on a PND it should be in a similar format to Garmin or flytec so it's secure and can be used as a backup to show proof of my flight if the 5030 fails.
6. Would like to have "pages" such that page one displays X range scale, ABCD INFO Boxes.... Page two would be different and easily configured and selected. This all for quick display.

Basically I loved the XCSoar software but struggled with getting it integrated into my setup due to the PPC hardware. Using a HP 310 seems attractive because it has a GPS, a better display and is small enough. But PORTRAIT needs to be used and battery life must be addressed.

For non XC flights, my 5030 is more than enough. But we should consider guys flying XC without a 5030/6030 and they may want something a bit different on the LK8000. Still, having seen XCSoar,it pretty much had it all. If we're going to the PND's then the above items are important for XC and for some comp stuff.


Regards,
John
Go to Top of Page
Page: of 3 Previous Topic Topic Next Topic  
Next Page
 New Topic  Reply to Topic
Jump To:
PostFrontal Forum © PostFrontal - La community del Volo a Vela Go To Top Of Page
This page was generated in 0.25 seconds. Snitz Forums 2000

Since 2006, owned and maintained by PostFrontal S.A.S. di Giuliano Golfieri & c. - VAT ID: IT05264240960
THIS WEBSITE ONLY USES FUNCTIONAL COOKIES
Privacy & Cookie Policy