T O P I C R E V I E W |
danielvelez |
Posted - 10/07/2018 : 22:53:20 Hello there.
I´ve read a lot of intense topics about IGC validation, and I´m aware that it´s a sensitive issue.
Anyway, a few things:
If you go to https://www.fai.org/sport/paragliding?upcoming=1&f%5B0%5D=fai_event_year%3A2018, that´s the main fai site for paragliding, as of today you will find that there´s a new published list of valid loggers:
https://www.fai.org/news/approved-instruments-list-published-civl-website
It does not show on "news" for Hanggliders but I´m guessing it applies too.
Anyway, the list is somehow lost at the momment (can´t access it anymore) but a few hours ago I managed to download the pdf and it stated that LK8000 is not allowed because is missing the developer declaration...
Now i see that maybe the "declaration" is something as simple as what Naviter has done here:
http://vali.fai-civl.org/documents/CAT1RecorderConformity_Naviter_Oudie_Hyper.pdf
So maybe, if the Coolwind or any other developer can verify that "lk8000" checks as of stated on the declaration, then maybe we can validate the software for CAT 1 Competitions.
The issue is that we fly in CAT 1 events with provided standalone trackers nowadays, and we get scored mainly with them, but it would be really nice to know that our personal igc track recorded by our flying software can act as a valid backup in case the provided tracker would be faulty or mess something up.
I´m one of the "don´t really care" hangglider pilots out there, and as a scorekeeper on local cat 2 events, I will always allow a IGC file without too much messing around. If someone wants to take the time and effort to cheat on a hanggliding or paragliding meet, then be my guest, as it has to be a much better hacker than a pilot to acomplish a "fake" flight on a daily basis before we close tracklog reception...
So just take a look at the requirement.. if it´s as simple as a declaration, heck it´s easier than any line of code that you guys have put into the software!
By the way, the current IGC logs created by android version are validated ok when checked on http://vali.fai-civl.org/validation.html
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9 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
danielvelez |
Posted - 25/01/2019 : 00:06:32 quote: Originally posted by brunotl
after reading CIVL requirement documentation, some update is needed in software, i will look for that this winter, no time before.
Hello Bruno.
Had you have some time to look up into this "FAI" valid recording? It would be really nice to be able to use the app during the next hang gliding worlds as main igc recorder. |
Mtbrider |
Posted - 18/07/2018 : 19:16:15 I carry an FR300 as well as using LK8000 on Android, so the FR300 does some of the FAI certification (for badge flights only though) and as a back up logger. |
danielvelez |
Posted - 17/07/2018 : 21:32:41 Thanks. |
brunotl |
Posted - 17/07/2018 : 18:50:07 after reading CIVL requirement documentation, some update is needed in software, i will look for that this winter, no time before. |
danielvelez |
Posted - 17/07/2018 : 15:29:37 quote: Originally posted by AlphaLima
quote:
or XCSoar (best all-round flying apps, well developed and tested)
With all respect, if this is your impression, why don't you use XCS*** and stop posting this forum about IGC and Fake Flarm issues all not related to LK8000? Do you really think to encourage us working for you, this way?
You got me wrong...
I'm saying that both LK8000 and XCSOAR are the most developed and think throught apps out there, with a lot of active pilots involved on the development and so they should be allowed on CAT 1 events.
I personally preffer lk8000 over any other app, and because of that, is that I'm so into "sending" feedback and requests... My only intention is to help improve the software, not to complain about it. I really appreciate the work you guys put into this app.
So I apologize if that was not how i have been participating on the forum. If you think that my posts are way out of subject or that they don't address real issues, then I will try my best to "ask" before posting.
So back on this matter, what I'm trying to say is that LK8000 should be recognized as a "good enought" recorder by the FAI. And that maybe we only need a developer signed declaration on some of the capabilities of the IGC recorder to make this thing happen.
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AlphaLima |
Posted - 16/07/2018 : 09:10:46 quote:
or XCSoar (best all-round flying apps, well developed and tested)
With all respect, if this is your impression, why don't you use XCS*** and stop posting this forum about IGC and Fake Flarm issues all not related to LK8000? Do you really think to encourage us working for you, this way? |
danielvelez |
Posted - 16/07/2018 : 04:23:53 quote: Originally posted by Mtbrider
So does an android phone, with it's internal pressure sensor, count as suitable for IGC validation? I have Oudie recorder and LK8000 running but neither appear to offer IGC validation.
Ok. The Fai list is up again on the website:
https://www.fai.org/sites/default/files/civl/documents/cat_1_instruments_e2018-07_bw.pdf
This states that neigher LK8000 or XCSoar (best all-round flying apps, well developed and tested) are accepted because of the lack of a declaration from developers.
On the other side, xctrack is accepted on the list without any notes... but on the app, you can see that it says that it needs internal barometer on the android to be "FAI CAT 1 Certified"... No external baro input is allowed.
And there´s one big "miss" on the list: GPSDUMP for android as a logger, that is the default app for downloading tracks on pc with signature and everything, and that has a logger and everything on the android app, now seems to be left out of the list without any comments...
Alt-Air was on the first 2016 list, but now is gone also.
This is a downdraft for android flying.
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Mtbrider |
Posted - 11/07/2018 : 17:56:55 So does an android phone, with it's internal pressure sensor, count as suitable for IGC validation? I have Oudie recorder and LK8000 running but neither appear to offer IGC validation. |
danielvelez |
Posted - 11/07/2018 : 02:57:47 Instruments accepted for FAI Category 1 competitions 10 July 2017
Brand Model(s) Software/ firmware versions Group Status Reason Aircotec TopNavigator all 3 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Aircotec XC-Trainer (all other models except MXP) all 3 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Aircotec XC-Trainer MXP all 3 NOT accepted Doesn't record GPS altitude Ascent h1 all 3 NOT accepted Doesn't record GPS altitude Ascent h2 all 3 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Bräuniger Compeo >= 2.27 2 Accepted Bräuniger Competino >= 1.22 2 Accepted Bräuniger IQ Basic GPS >= 1.3.07 2 Accepted Bräuniger IQ Compeo+ >= 3.38m 1 Accepted Bräuniger IQ Competino+ >= 3.10r 1 Accepted Bräuniger Sensbox >= 3.02 1 Accepted Compass C-Pilot Evo all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Compass C-Pilot Pro all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Compass Easy Pilot all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Digifly AIR >= 501 3 Accepted Digifly Leonardo Plus all 3 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Digifly Leonardo Pro all 3 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Flymaster B1 NAV all 3 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Flymaster F1 module all 3 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Flymaster GPS >= 2.02a 1 Accepted Flymaster GPS SD >= 2.02a 1 Accepted Flymaster GPS SD + >= 2.02a 1 Accepted Flymaster LIVE >= 1.07a 1 Accepted Flymaster LIVE SD >= 1.07a 1 Accepted Flymaster LIVE SD 3G >= 2.02a 1 Accepted Flymaster Tracker >= 2.02a 1 Accepted Flymaster NAV >= 1.07a 1 Accepted Flymaster NAV SD >= 1.07a 1 Accepted Flynet XC all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Flytec 5020 >= 1.22 2 Accepted Flytec 5030 >= 2.27 2 Accepted Flytec 6015 >= 1.3.07 2 Accepted Flytec 6020 >= 3.10r 1 Accepted Flytec 6030 >= 3.38m 1 Accepted Flytec Connect 1 17 1 Accepted Flytec Element Track all 1 Accepted Flytec SensBox >= 3.02 1 Accepted GARMIN models with pressure sensor all 3 NOT accepted Doesn't record ICAO ISA altitude; doesn't record GPS altitude; GARMIN models without pressure sensor all 3 NOT accepted Doesn't record ICAO ISA altitude LK-8000 Android phones with pressure sensor all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the developer Mycloudbase Tracker Android phones with pressure sensor >= 8.01 1 Accepted Naviter Oudie 3 all 1 Accepted Naviter Oudie 3+ all 1 Accepted Naviter Oudie 4 all 1 Accepted Naviter Oudie 4 Basic all 1 Accepted Renschler CoMo all 3 NOT accepted Doesn't record GPS altitude Renschler SOL all 3 NOT accepted Doesn't record GPS altitude Reversale VGP Competition all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Sky Bean Sky Drop >= 3820 1 Accepted SKYTRAXX 2.0 all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer SKYTRAXX 2.0 PLUS >= 1.75 1 Accepted SKYTRAXX 3.0 >= 3.0.8 1 Accepted SKYTRAXX VARIO all 1 NOT accepted Doesn't record ICAO ISA altitude Syride SYS'GPS V1 and V2 all 1 NOT accepted Doesn't record ICAO ISA altitude Syride SYS'GPS V3 < 3.2 1 NOT accepted Doesn't record ICAO ISA altitude Syride SYS'GPS V3 >= 3.2 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Syride SYS'NAV V1 and V2 all 1 NOT accepted Doesn't record ICAO ISA altitude Syride SYS'NAV V3 < 3.16 1 NOT accepted Doesn't record ICAO ISA altitude Syride SYS'NAV V3 >= 3.16 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the manufacturer Vertica V2 with pressure sensor LK-8000 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the developer Volirium P1 17 1 Accepted XCSoar Android phones with pressure sensor all 1 NOT accepted No declaration from the developer XCTrack Android phones >= 0.6 1 Accepted XC Tracer XC Tracer all 1 Accepted
Group descriptions: 1 - Instrument generates and signs IGC file from recorded flight data on internal file system; The file system is accessible through standard USB Mass Storage Device. 2 - Instrument generates and signs IGC file from recorded flight data; The file is accessible through serial port by PC software. 3 - Instrument stores flight data on internal memory; The data is accessible through serial port; IGC file is generated from the data and signed by PC software. |
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